Posted by Rain on October 22, 2006, 6:55 pm
mm,
Anti-seize is a wonderfull product and does work as advertised. I have
been using it for many years on many different applications and have
never had an issue with anything backing out. As long as you followe
the proper torque specs for what you are doing the screws, nuts and
bolts will stay where they are supposed to and you will find them much
much easier to remove next time. I have used it on everything from twin
Cat 3508 engines, deisel generators, plumbing parts, lawn mowers and
yes, even motorcycles. Do not use grease in high tem locations as it
can make a terrible mess and you will find that once it is heated it
doesn't help at all with removal, just gets your tools messy. And also,
with heating your transmission and engine covers with a torch, be very
carefull doing this. As long as there is no discoloration, you should
be fine. If you have more issues with other bolts and are planning on
taking the motor out, you can put it in a large black garbage bag or
wrap it in plastic and the spray every nut, bolt and screw with a good
coat of penetrating lube. They make several different brands with
several different prices. It's worth the extra money and time in the
long run. After you spray everything down, wrap it up and let it sit
for a couple days. You'll find that parts come apart much easier. Good
luck, hope you get that classic back on two wheels soon.
mm wrote:
> Pre. S. Is there such a thing as tempered aluminum?
> So I got all the screws that I needed to out of the '69 Honda that
> hasn't been ridden since 1972, and I'm wondering if there is a way to
> make it easier the next time**. When I bought spark plugs last time,
> they gave me anti-sieze stuff, for a dollar, that is supposed to make
> the spark plugs not stick to the cylinder heads (especially maybe when
> the plugs are steel and the heads are aluminum, sort of like in many
> motorcycles where the screws are steel and the crankcases are
> aluminum.)
> Can I, should I use this anti-sieze stuff when I reassemble the
> motorcycle? So it won't be stuck two years from now when I need
> to do something, or 20 years from now.
> Or will this allow the screws and bolts to come out when I don't want
> them to?
> Thanks.
> **How I got it apart: They don't sell impact drivers at HD or Lowe's
> but they do have 2 basic models for sale at a small number of online
> sources. The easiest to buy from was JCWhitney, www.jcw.com , because
> there are other things there for me to buy, like motorcycle tire
> irons, tail light pulsator, rear turn signal lights (this bike never
> had them)
> JCW has 3 things worth buying.
> 1) A set of 13 or 16 bits for my old impact driver. I'd ruined 2 and
> now 3 of the 4 bits that came with it.
> 2) An impact driver pretty much just like the one I already have,
> that I also bought from JCW.
> 3) A bigger one, not in the printed catalog, that has a big red
> rubber grip, part of which makes it more unlikely that you will hit
> your hand with the hammer. It also comes with 8 bits, 2phillips, 2
> slot, and both short and 2 inches long. The long ones are great. I
> didn't think I would like the driver especially however, but I do.
> I also bought at harbor freight a set of 4 impact driver extension
> bars, 4 different lengths.
> All this was still not enough for the right side, I think, and I ended
> up heating the side of the case where the threads are, with a propane
> torch. The Klymer manual says not to do this for 3 reasons. The only
> one I remember at the moment is not to lose temper, but is there such
> a thing as tempered aluminum? Anyhow, I don't think I heated
> anything much more than it would be if the engine were running, and it
> made it easier to get the screws out.
Posted by Doug Miller on October 23, 2006, 7:43 am
>So I got all the screws that I needed to out of the '69 Honda that
>hasn't been ridden since 1972, and I'm wondering if there is a way to
>make it easier the next time**. When I bought spark plugs last time,
>they gave me anti-sieze stuff, for a dollar, that is supposed to make
>the spark plugs not stick to the cylinder heads (especially maybe when
>the plugs are steel and the heads are aluminum, sort of like in many
>motorcycles where the screws are steel and the crankcases are
>aluminum.)
>Can I, should I use this anti-sieze stuff when I reassemble the
>motorcycle? So it won't be stuck two years from now when I need
>to do something, or 20 years from now.
That'll work. Another option is stainless steel screws -- putting aluminum and
carbon steel together causes the steel to corrode if it gets the least bit
damp (even humidity is enough), but stainless steel won't have that problem.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
Posted by N8N on October 23, 2006, 9:19 am
Doug Miller wrote:
> >So I got all the screws that I needed to out of the '69 Honda that
> >hasn't been ridden since 1972, and I'm wondering if there is a way to
> >make it easier the next time**. When I bought spark plugs last time,
> >they gave me anti-sieze stuff, for a dollar, that is supposed to make
> >the spark plugs not stick to the cylinder heads (especially maybe when
> >the plugs are steel and the heads are aluminum, sort of like in many
> >motorcycles where the screws are steel and the crankcases are
> >aluminum.)
> >
> >Can I, should I use this anti-sieze stuff when I reassemble the
> >motorcycle? So it won't be stuck two years from now when I need
> >to do something, or 20 years from now.
> That'll work. Another option is stainless steel screws -- putting aluminum and
> carbon steel together causes the steel to corrode if it gets the least bit
> damp (even humidity is enough), but stainless steel won't have that problem.
Don't use stainless in any application where strength is critical (head
bolts, suspension bolts, etc.) as 304 stainless is not as strong as a
grade 5 fastener. Also any stainless screw will require anti-seize on
the threads to prevent galling. this is not to say that stainless is
bad however, lots of bolts on my '55 Stude have been replaced with
stainless - just not critical ones as I described above.
nate
Posted by Doug Miller on October 23, 2006, 9:29 am
>Doug Miller wrote:
>>
>> >So I got all the screws that I needed to out of the '69 Honda that
>> >hasn't been ridden since 1972, and I'm wondering if there is a way to
>> >make it easier the next time**. When I bought spark plugs last time,
>> >they gave me anti-sieze stuff, for a dollar, that is supposed to make
>> >the spark plugs not stick to the cylinder heads (especially maybe when
>> >the plugs are steel and the heads are aluminum, sort of like in many
>> >motorcycles where the screws are steel and the crankcases are
>> >aluminum.)
>> >
>> >Can I, should I use this anti-sieze stuff when I reassemble the
>> >motorcycle? So it won't be stuck two years from now when I need
>> >to do something, or 20 years from now.
>>
>> That'll work. Another option is stainless steel screws -- putting aluminum
> and
>> carbon steel together causes the steel to corrode if it gets the least bit
>> damp (even humidity is enough), but stainless steel won't have that problem.
>>
>Don't use stainless in any application where strength is critical (head
>bolts, suspension bolts, etc.) as 304 stainless is not as strong as a
>grade 5 fastener.
Obviously strength is not critical in the areas where the OP is having a
problem: the screws are going into aluminum. *Any* steel fastener, stainless
or not, is stronger than aluminum, and if there's going to be a
mechanical failure, it won't be in the steel.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.
Posted by Joe on October 23, 2006, 11:08 pm
> Obviously strength is not critical in the areas where the OP is having a
> problem: the screws are going into aluminum. *Any* steel fastener,
> stainless
> or not, is stronger than aluminum, and if there's going to be a
> mechanical failure, it won't be in the steel.
A quick lesson... The thread strength could be stronger than the "twist
off" strength of any bolt you put in there... It all depends on how many
threads you catch, whether the thread was cut or roll tapped, and some other
(useless?) information to most folks...
Imagine you have a threaded (tapped) hole that is 1/4" deep with a 3/4"
stainless bolt. You will likely strip the threads out before you break the
bolt... Not make the hole 3" deep and fully threaded... The bolt will snap
if tightened too much before the sum "shear point" of the threads is
reached...
Stainless should be fine to use, but it brings a lot of problems along with
it and I totally agree with another poster who said not to use it where
strength is needed.
If you need strength, go with grade 5 black oxide. It's ugly, but rust
somewhat resistant.
Want to learn more?
http://www.tribology-abc.com/calculators/stripping.htm
http://dodgeram.org/tech/specs/bolts/SAE_bolt_strength.html
http://www.guhring.com/downloads/GUHRING_Tap_Compass_Lo_Res.pdf
http://www.autodrill.com (My site)
http://www.multi-drill.com (My site again - with drilling and some tapping
reference tools)
Joe in Northern, NJ - V#8013-R
Currently Riding The "Mother Ship"
Ride a motorcycle in or near NJ?
http://tinyurl.com/5apkg
http://www.youthelate.com
Help Cure Cancer: http://yunx.com/UDvroc.htm
XML Sitemap
> So I got all the screws that I needed to out of the '69 Honda that
> hasn't been ridden since 1972, and I'm wondering if there is a way to
> make it easier the next time**. When I bought spark plugs last time,
> they gave me anti-sieze stuff, for a dollar, that is supposed to make
> the spark plugs not stick to the cylinder heads (especially maybe when
> the plugs are steel and the heads are aluminum, sort of like in many
> motorcycles where the screws are steel and the crankcases are
> aluminum.)
> Can I, should I use this anti-sieze stuff when I reassemble the
> motorcycle? So it won't be stuck two years from now when I need
> to do something, or 20 years from now.
> Or will this allow the screws and bolts to come out when I don't want
> them to?
> Thanks.
> **How I got it apart: They don't sell impact drivers at HD or Lowe's
> but they do have 2 basic models for sale at a small number of online
> sources. The easiest to buy from was JCWhitney, www.jcw.com , because
> there are other things there for me to buy, like motorcycle tire
> irons, tail light pulsator, rear turn signal lights (this bike never
> had them)
> JCW has 3 things worth buying.
> 1) A set of 13 or 16 bits for my old impact driver. I'd ruined 2 and
> now 3 of the 4 bits that came with it.
> 2) An impact driver pretty much just like the one I already have,
> that I also bought from JCW.
> 3) A bigger one, not in the printed catalog, that has a big red
> rubber grip, part of which makes it more unlikely that you will hit
> your hand with the hammer. It also comes with 8 bits, 2phillips, 2
> slot, and both short and 2 inches long. The long ones are great. I
> didn't think I would like the driver especially however, but I do.
> I also bought at harbor freight a set of 4 impact driver extension
> bars, 4 different lengths.
> All this was still not enough for the right side, I think, and I ended
> up heating the side of the case where the threads are, with a propane
> torch. The Klymer manual says not to do this for 3 reasons. The only
> one I remember at the moment is not to lose temper, but is there such
> a thing as tempered aluminum? Anyhow, I don't think I heated
> anything much more than it would be if the engine were running, and it
> made it easier to get the screws out.