More questions about getting my '69 Honda running.

 

More questions about getting my '69 Honda CB450 running, that hasn't
run since 1972.

I took the carburetors off, disassembled them and cleaned them in
Permatex carburetor solution.  Not a gas tank additive or a spray, but
what comes in a gallon can.  Now the throttle and choke work fine.  

I've cleaned the gas tank a second time with chains, bolts, and
kerosene, and I removed and cleaned the petcock.   It had a 4 inch
tube, 3 inches of which were filled with gummy or solid gasoline.  And
inside, the valve was full of solid gasoline, sort of light brown dust
caked in, pretty hard, or hard dark brown syrup.  All had to be reamed
out with a screwdriver. Fortunately regarding the 4" tube, I have a
long narrow one that fit perfectly.

I also used liquid wrench and got the front brake linkage moving.
It's 80% now and with a little more exercise it will be 100%.  The
rear brake seems fine.

Thanks for the encouragement.

But more questions.  (I thought there were only 3, but I keep thinking
of more. :-|  )

I notice that there is a big hub for each wheel and the wheel rotates
around that.  Do I need to lubricate in the circular slot that
surrounds the hub, inside the rotating part?  30 weight?


For the things that are working well, the throttle and the front
brake, do I still have to disconnect the cables and lube inside?  It
seems like a lot of work for minimal gain.  If I do have to, what
should I use.  30 weight, 20 weight, WD-40?


Because I may not be able to make a key for the ignition switch (or it
will be expensive) I'm making my own ignition swtich.   I was going to
have a key switch for everything, and another switch in series for the
head and tail lights.   That would duplicate the functions of the
original switch.  

I see that newer bikes have a cutout switch on the handlebar near the
right thumb.  Should I add a cutout switch?  

My old ignition switch is, and the new one will be, on the left below
and at the front of the gas tank.  It's pretty easy to reach while
sitting on the bike.   But, should I try to put the cutout switch near
my right thumb?  Is location important?  It doesn't look easy, unless
they sell switches I haven't seen on the web.   Or is it good enough
where the current switch is, or do I not need one at all?  (There is
no fork lock on this bike, so there is no key lock by the fork)


The 3-4 inch long, 1/2" wide rubber bellows-like thing where the front
brake cable connects to the front brake mechanism, to protect the wire
inside I guess, is falling apart.  Should I be able to get one of
those at any good cycle shop, or order one somewhere.  Do I need to
replace it?


The clutch is more difficult to pull than it should be.  I haven't
found my grease gun (but I will) so I don't know if that little bit of
grease I'm supposed to put there (and one other place).  I don't think
the grease will make a difference.  Is the oil inside the
oil/transmission sump gummed up -- does oil do that like gas does?
Will it be enough to change the oil, or do I have to take off the
cover and take the thing apart.

Is it likely that lubricating the clutch cable will make a difference,
or should I save that for later, if other things don't work?


I also need to oil the front brake mechanism, outside the hub, but I
wonder if regular oil will replace the liquid wrench I used to free up
the stuck parts.  Do I need to wait a while before trying to use the
oil?    Do I need to take apart the front hub and lubricate anything
in there?

Thanks for just reading this and for any that you can answer.

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mm wrote:

 mm- good to hear from you! Glad to hear things are nearly there.


Good good.

 Good good.

 You are welcome from all of us.

 And away we go.....

 No, this is the brakes. NO LUBRICATION!!!!


 First WD-40 works great as a penetrating oil and W ater D istplacement
formula 40, but it is worthless as a long term form of lubrication.

 Having said that, use some Liquid wrench or similar followed by 30
weight or cable lube. You don't have to remove the cable, but be
patient and make sure you do an adequate job.
 Short answer- you should do it.

 Good good.

 Personally, I've only used that cut off switch to confound myself and
wonder why the bike wouldn't start....I would say it's not needed. but
there are others that will tell you it is and you'll die without it,
ect.....


 Proboably should replace it, it's the dust boot for the cable. Should
be able to fine one on e-bay or similar for a dollar or two.


Oil the cable, all moving bits and grease the "grease nipples".

 Yes, it will.

 You should change the oil, but I wouldn't worry about taking the cover
off unless the above oilings and greasing do nothing. Also, remember
that these "older bikes" have a much higher clutch pull than say, a new
Honda NightHawk.


 No, just apply some 30 weight to the moving parts for now.

 

wrote:


Wow.  It's a good thing I asked.  Oiling there would have been a big
mistake!

 This must mean the wheel goes down the middle somewhere, with the
brakes on one side and the rest of the hub on the other before it gets
to the axle. Does anyone ever oil the axle bearings deep inside?

Since I read this, I've been pouring little bursts of oil down the
cables for two days, a little bit more after the prior burst gets
sucked in.   I don't think the oil has gotten more than a foot on the
brake or clutch, but nonethelss, the brake cable goes all the way back
to the full open position now, and the clutch cable might be working
better.    However I made sure I was in gear for once, and even with
the clutch lever squeezed all the way in, the bike was still in gear,
didn't roll.  There are three adjustments for the clutch, and I guess
I am going to have to use the one that is not just a cable adjustment.

Rolling the bike in gear did move the piston down though. I was a bit
afraid the engine was frozen, but it seems not.  I was afraid of that
because I can't do anything with the kick starter.  Continued below.


BTW, what do cutout switches cut out?  Just the engine, or the engine
and the lights too?  I guess it's not the lights, but I want to be
sure.

I only get one chance to drill the holes in this piece of aluminum,
because I was lucky enough to find in my basement a piece of 1/8"
aluminmum with two bends so that it sticks out like the original lock
bracket did.  It also goes to the left from the mounting point.  It's
just about perfect.  That's why I almost never throw anything away.

I had to cut off three part of it to get the piece I wanted.  I love
my band saw and its metal cutting blade.


Maybe this wouldn't happen to me, because the switch is going to be
right next to the key swtich and the headlight/taillight switch.   So
presumably I'll notice if it is not UP when I try to start the bike.  

How do you stop your bike every time?  You put the key in and turn the
engine off, or do you leave a key in while you are running?


I'm still looking for my little grease gun, but today I bought a tube
of grease for the big grease gun.  Just 2 dollars but it's not the
money.  The little one is little, and the other one will be big and
greasy if I fill it up again.


Did that Sunday.  Thanks.


BTW, it has an electric starter and a kick starter, and the kick
starter doesn't want to engage.  I would take the side off the engine
and check out the parts inside, but the cover has screws all around
and the ones on the bottom are obstructed by the muffler.  How hard is
it to take off the muffler.  There are two long chrome hex heads, but
I would think it is rusted in place.  ??

Also, it says use 20 weight below 60^F and 30 weight above 60F.
That's right on the borderline of most of the good days.  I guess I
have to use 20W-40.  Is that all right?   I would use 20W-30 but I
haven't seen it for sale.  Do you think I'll be able to find 20W-30?


Thanks a lot.

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mm wrote:
Does anyone ever oil the axle bearings deep inside? No....they can be
taken out and re-packed with grease, but if you go that far, I'd just
replace them.


 Patience is a virtue, keep it up until it drips out the other side of
the cable.


 Common for a bike that has been sitting....my Hardley Ableson used to
do that if it sat for a couple of days. You can free up the clutch by
pulling it in and rocking the bike back and forth- don't be gentle,
just rock it, it will come loose.


 Shut off the key....

 Leave it in.


 Before you try to remove anything here, I'd get a manual.....also, use
plenty of PB B'Laster or Liquid wrench on those bolts/screws/ect before
you try to remove them. You will want to use an impact driver for the
philips head screws to remove them, or "make one" by using a hammer and
a PERFECTLY FITTING  screwdriver. Hit the handle with the driver in
each screw, then go back and hit the driver as you are turning the
screws.


 That will work, though I'd use 10w40 synthetic and not worry about it
anytime of the year.

 

wrote:


OK. I wasn't saying mine need it.  After all, I've only rolled the
bike less maybe 100 feet total!  Of course it is grease and not oil.
What was I thinking.


Missed a day, but I will.


I'll do that.  

Could this have anything to do with the kick starter not doing much,
since I put the bike in neutral but haven't been able to disengage the
clutch?  


I could do that.


I have one.  I've used it quite a bit when something wouldn't turn,
and it works great.  OTOH, sometimes I think it's not too good, and I
might buy a more expensive one.  This was iirc 10 dollars 15 years
ago, with 2 straight and 2 Phillips bits.  One of the phillips is
pretty much ruined.


I'll think about that.

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