My Bike is Hard To Start
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My Bike is Hard To Start Sheep 07-18-2008
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Posted by Sheep on July 18, 2008, 7:06 am


Beverages of your choice all around. Roach's tab in honor of his
selling the bar. He's such a nice guy.

My bike has always been hard to start. And by hard to start sometimes
I wonder if it will or not. I always attributed it to the starter
might not be up to the added strain of the 103 build plus when I've
asked I was always told the 07 and 08 models are hard to start. After
a few cranks in public where I was asked "What the heck was that" and
a conversation with TL I finally had it checked.

At the dealer bright and early last Saturday morning about 8:30.
Service department was not busy.

Asked the service writer to step outside with me and look at my bike.
His bike is sitting 5 feet away from mine with the same engine build.
Then I ask him to start my bike 4 times.

1st time -         Starts right up.
2nd time -         He says "What?"
3rd time -         He says "That's not right"
4th time -         He says "DANG"

He starts his 3 times and makes the statement "Not quite the same is
it?" We walk back in and the technicians ask what the ugly noise from
outside was. Trouble shooting starts:

1. Primary cover pulled and teeth inspected. Fine
2. Battery is showing good but a bit low. Battery pulled, charged
and reinstalled. Problem is still there.
3. They have a transmission on the shelf to be returned due to paint
peeling. My transmission removed and the other installed. Problem is
still there. Mine reinstalled.
4. TP sensor pulled and inspected for metal. Nope.

Head scratching. Computer searched. There is a service bulletin
concerning early P&A 103 Stage II kits. Seems the timing mark for
the rear cam was incorrect on some. Doesn't tell you what was the
wrong position just what the correct one should be. Technicians are
thinking that if the timing mark is advanced 1 notch then the bike
would start hard, then the ECM would compensate to allow it to run.
Mine is one of the very first 103S2 kits built for the 2007 models.

So at 1:30 I saddled up and headed to the beach. Rode all around, no
one threw rocks at me or tried to run me off the road, and it started
every time. Started hard but started.

Tuesday morning I dropped it back off to have the cams inspected and
got a flat rear tire on the way. Had my first tow using the HOG
Roadside Assistance program. Joy of joys. Tow operator said he sees
more flats at that exit than anywhere else and he thinks the tire shop
owner there throws out nails.

Well, it wasn't the cam. They checked a couple of other things and
called HD Tech Services. Tech told them some bikes just were hard to
start and I needed to learn to live with it. If I couldn't live with
it Tech services suggested that I have automatic compression releases
installed by either having them added to my heads or replacing my
heads. All at my expense. My dealer didn't agree with them that I
should pay.

So I called HD customer service yesterday morning after talking with
my dealer. Yes TL, I have number in my cell phone along with the HOG
roadside assistance number. Talked to the nice lady who asked me
silly questions like if I had rotated winter and summer air in the
tires, etc. She was supposed to talk to tech services and call my
dealer. I'll call my dealer in the morning to see if they have heard
anything. If not I call the nice lady back.


Dave (Dukes Sheep)
'07 FLHTCU NAH#2 DOF #5 SENS
"Oh bother" said Pooh, as he was connected at 14.4kps

A: Because it disturbs the logical flow of the message.
Q: Why is topposting frowned upon?

Posted by Ryder Rick on July 18, 2008, 11:50 am



> Well, it wasn't the cam. They checked a couple of other things and
> called HD Tech Services. Tech told them some bikes just were hard to
> start and I needed to learn to live with it. If I couldn't live with
> it Tech services suggested that I have automatic compression releases
> installed by either having them added to my heads or replacing my
> heads. All at my expense. My dealer didn't agree with them that I
> should pay.
>
> So I called HD customer service yesterday morning after talking with
> my dealer. Yes TL, I have number in my cell phone along with the HOG
> roadside assistance number. Talked to the nice lady who asked me
> silly questions like if I had rotated winter and summer air in the
> tires, etc. She was supposed to talk to tech services and call my
> dealer. I'll call my dealer in the morning to see if they have heard
> anything. If not I call the nice lady back.

Tell them to substitute a new ECU/CPU, and I'll bet the problem goes away.
I'm guessing that there is something wrong with the CPU in that it is
trying to fire the mota on the first go-around. Electric start likes
the ignition to wait til the second or third go-around to clear the
mota and get some speed up.

The alternative would be to get a time delay module (Omeron) and wire
it into the coil power circuit and set the delay for 1.5~2 seconds.
--
Ryder Rick
<there all fixed, NEXT!>


Posted by nobody #1 on July 18, 2008, 7:27 pm




Ryder Rick wrote:

>
> > Well, it wasn't the cam. They checked a couple of other things and
> > called HD Tech Services. Tech told them some bikes just were hard to
> > start and I needed to learn to live with it. If I couldn't live with
> > it Tech services suggested that I have automatic compression releases
> > installed by either having them added to my heads or replacing my
> > heads. All at my expense. My dealer didn't agree with them that I
> > should pay.
> >
> > So I called HD customer service yesterday morning after talking with
> > my dealer. Yes TL, I have number in my cell phone along with the HOG
> > roadside assistance number. Talked to the nice lady who asked me
> > silly questions like if I had rotated winter and summer air in the
> > tires, etc. She was supposed to talk to tech services and call my
> > dealer. I'll call my dealer in the morning to see if they have heard
> > anything. If not I call the nice lady back.
>
> Tell them to substitute a new ECU/CPU, and I'll bet the problem goes away.
> I'm guessing that there is something wrong with the CPU in that it is
> trying to fire the mota on the first go-around. Electric start likes
> the ignition to wait til the second or third go-around to clear the
> mota and get some speed up.
>
> The alternative would be to get a time delay module (Omeron) and wire
> it into the coil power circuit and set the delay for 1.5~2 seconds.
> --

Goddamn, now that's funny!


Posted by Steve Irving on July 18, 2008, 7:53 pm


nobody #1 wrote:
>
> Ryder Rick wrote:
>
>>
>>> Well, it wasn't the cam. They checked a couple of other things and
>>> called HD Tech Services. Tech told them some bikes just were hard to
>>> start and I needed to learn to live with it. If I couldn't live with
>>> it Tech services suggested that I have automatic compression releases
>>> installed by either having them added to my heads or replacing my
>>> heads. All at my expense. My dealer didn't agree with them that I
>>> should pay.
>>>
>>> So I called HD customer service yesterday morning after talking with
>>> my dealer. Yes TL, I have number in my cell phone along with the HOG
>>> roadside assistance number. Talked to the nice lady who asked me
>>> silly questions like if I had rotated winter and summer air in the
>>> tires, etc. She was supposed to talk to tech services and call my
>>> dealer. I'll call my dealer in the morning to see if they have heard
>>> anything. If not I call the nice lady back.
>> Tell them to substitute a new ECU/CPU, and I'll bet the problem goes away.
>> I'm guessing that there is something wrong with the CPU in that it is
>> trying to fire the mota on the first go-around. Electric start likes
>> the ignition to wait til the second or third go-around to clear the
>> mota and get some speed up.
>>
>> The alternative would be to get a time delay module (Omeron) and wire
>> it into the coil power circuit and set the delay for 1.5~2 seconds.
>> --
>
> Goddamn, now that's funny!
>

If ya skip a step in the diagnostic flow chart......you almost always replace
the ECM.....usually for no reason at all.

<snerk>

Posted by nunya on July 18, 2008, 5:09 pm



<snip>
> That was beautiful, man. I'm posting it on the wall in my shop.
>
> Is it too early for a frosty Guinness out there? They are on me until the
> Owner does the math...
>
> --
> Rand McNally BS#263
> And handing a copy to any service manager I meet who needs to know...

even though i am not one to approve of cursing (yeah, i know to expect it in
here) that was outstandingly beautiful.

as to running a tab... since the place is between owners and waiting to
all of the papers to be signed and such, i believe that the rules state that
the new owner can't collect the debts to the past owner. so top shelf on my
tab until they run out of patron and j.d. after that ya'll should be
intoxicated enough not to notice that you are having to finish off the
watered down swill that roach had a tendecy to serve after midnight. and if
you see that roach guy don't tell him where i live until the mad wears off.
michael



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