Posted by High Plains Thumper on July 9, 2010, 8:42 am
Mark Olson wrote:
> Snag wrote:
>
>> Gyroscopic precession is what makes countersteering work . Those
>> forces are significant enough to make a bike that weighs several
>> hundred pounds lean into a turn ...
>
> Gyroscopic forces are significant in motorcycle wheels. And they
> contribute to countersteering. But they are NOT *primarily* why
> countersteering works.
>
> There have been plenty of peer-reviewed papers on how motorcycles
> steer. The phenomenon is well understood by academics who have
> studied it and almost unknown to the vast majority of riders.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countersteering#Gyroscopic_effects
I suppose there is some effect, but just now in a rough calculation, a
15 inch back rim does 780 RPM at 65 MPH. Rotational velocity seems a
little slow. However, as a teen I remember doing about 55 MPH (in a 35
MPH zone) going down a steep hill on a 10 speed bike with 27 inch rims,
I did notice the gyroscopic effect on the front wheel on the downhill
road bends.
Just to think back then in the 1960's, we didn't wear bicycle helmets,
AFAIK, those weren't even available, I didn't know they existed.
--
HPT
Posted by ? on July 9, 2010, 8:52 am
> Just to think back then in the 1960's, we didn't wear bicycle helmets,
> AFAIK, those weren't even available, I didn't know they existed.
I first became aware of motorcycle helmets during the cold winter of
1963.
I thought that it would be nice to wear a helmet to keep my head warm,
but
the helmets at the base exchange cost about $12 and I couldn't afford
the luxury...
Posted by High Plains Thumper on July 9, 2010, 8:37 pm
? wrote:
> High Plains Thumper wrote:
>
>> Just to think back then in the 1960's, we didn't wear bicycle
>> helmets, AFAIK, those weren't even available, I didn't know they
>> existed.
>
> I first became aware of motorcycle helmets during the cold winter of
> 1963. I thought that it would be nice to wear a helmet to keep my
> head warm, but the helmets at the base exchange cost about $12 and I
> couldn't afford the luxury...
Especially at the same time in the base hobby shop, Scientific C/L
airplane kits were less than $1, .049 engine was under $3, rubber band
powered Comet kits were under $1 for the smaller and under $2 for the
larger.
At the same time, my idea of a motorcycle was a bicycle with balloons
tied to the struts making a thump-thump-thump against the spokes. That
was cooler sounding than playing cards. :-)
--
HPT
Posted by Mark Olson on July 9, 2010, 9:03 am
High Plains Thumper wrote:
> I suppose there is some effect, but just now in a rough calculation, a
> 15 inch back rim does 780 RPM at 65 MPH. Rotational velocity seems a
> little slow. However, as a teen I remember doing about 55 MPH (in a 35
> MPH zone) going down a steep hill on a 10 speed bike with 27 inch rims,
> I did notice the gyroscopic effect on the front wheel on the downhill
> road bends.
Motorcycle wheels despite their smaller diameter, are pretty heavy
compared to bicycle wheels, so their gyroscopic forces are orders of
magnitudes higher. Remember 16" front wheels? They were in vogue
in the mid 80s as a cure for too much gyroscopic effect.
I remember reading that roadracers had to develop significant upper
body strength to steer their bikes on twisty courses due to the gyro
effect.
Posted by High Plains Thumper on July 9, 2010, 8:32 pm
Mark Olson wrote:
> Motorcycle wheels despite their smaller diameter, are pretty heavy
> compared to bicycle wheels, so their gyroscopic forces are orders of
> magnitudes higher. Remember 16" front wheels? They were in vogue in
> the mid 80s as a cure for too much gyroscopic effect.
>
> I remember reading that roadracers had to develop significant upper
> body strength to steer their bikes on twisty courses due to the gyro
> effect.
Perhaps, but IME, I have never had a problem running the twisties, FWIW.
I think target fixation would be a greater problem, IMO.
--
HPT
>
>> Gyroscopic precession is what makes countersteering work . Those
>> forces are significant enough to make a bike that weighs several
>> hundred pounds lean into a turn ...
>
> Gyroscopic forces are significant in motorcycle wheels. And they
> contribute to countersteering. But they are NOT *primarily* why
> countersteering works.
>
> There have been plenty of peer-reviewed papers on how motorcycles
> steer. The phenomenon is well understood by academics who have
> studied it and almost unknown to the vast majority of riders.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countersteering#Gyroscopic_effects