Posted by Marc Gerges on September 28, 2008, 4:30 am
>>
>> No. The braking moment on the front wheel counters the force from weight
>> transfer, thereby holding the bike up. Research anti dive suspension.
>> You can have them on cars, too.
>>
>> It's plain physics.
>
> Go ahead, enlighten me.
In english it's tough, I'm missing vocabulary. Let me try an example,
see if we get there:
Look at this (rear) suspension:
http://www.ics-sporting.de/image2/CBF-88/o_3_2.jpg
Let's picture for a second this were the geometry of a front suspension,
the so-equipped bike travelling from right to left. Don't get lost in
any details regarding turning etc.
If you'd decelerate the front wheel by braking, it'll try to get slower
while the rest of the construction wants to travel on - weight transfer.
Assuming the CG of the bike will be above the swingarm, you'll have a
force from the wheel pushing right and a force from the bike pushing
left - presto, there's a moment. The swingarm can turn around this,
pushing the bike up.
>>> Anyway, what goes up must come down. You will have all of that reversed
>>> under acceleration.
>>
>> There's no force on the front of a bike that would reverse in
>> acceleration what the braking force does in deceleration.
>
> That, like, really makes no sense at all, though I had some beers in me
> so I may be slow.
That's ok, try again: the braking force on the wheel allows the
suspension to push up. There's no corresponding accelerating force on it
because it's a rear wheel drive bike. So there's nothing that could pull
it down.
cu
.\arc
Posted by Andrzej Rosa on September 28, 2008, 10:36 am
Dnia 2008-09-28 Marc Gerges napisał(a):
>>> It's plain physics.
>>
>> Go ahead, enlighten me.
> In english it's tough, I'm missing vocabulary. Let me try an example,
> see if we get there:
> Look at this (rear) suspension:
> http://www.ics-sporting.de/image2/CBF-88/o_3_2.jpg
> Let's picture for a second this were the geometry of a front suspension,
> the so-equipped bike travelling from right to left. Don't get lost in
> any details regarding turning etc.
> If you'd decelerate the front wheel by braking, it'll try to get slower
> while the rest of the construction wants to travel on - weight transfer.
> Assuming the CG of the bike will be above the swingarm, you'll have a
> force from the wheel pushing right and a force from the bike pushing
> left - presto, there's a moment. The swingarm can turn around this,
> pushing the bike up.
You are right, I see it now.
>>> There's no force on the front of a bike that would reverse in
>>> acceleration what the braking force does in deceleration.
>>
>> That, like, really makes no sense at all, though I had some beers in me
>> so I may be slow.
> That's ok, try again: the braking force on the wheel allows the
> suspension to push up. There's no corresponding accelerating force on it
> because it's a rear wheel drive bike. So there's nothing that could pull
> it down.
You are right here too. Thanks.
--
Andrzej Rosa
Posted by The Older Gentleman on September 26, 2008, 9:08 pm
> I've got to admit, the monster has quite some attraction to me. The
> aircooled twin, that characteristic sound, the desmo valve train.
The bigger Monsters are water-cooled now. It's a shame because all the
plumbing detracts from the essential simplicity that made the original
Monsters look so attractive.
I'm sure the new ones go better and faster for longer, but they just
don't look as good IMHO.
--
BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Yamaha XT600E Honda CB400F & SH50
GHPOTHUF#1 chateaudotmurrayatidnetdotcom
Nothing is more dangerous than an ignoramus with a workshop
manual, a 'can-do' attitude and a cheap set of tools
Posted by Marc Gerges on September 27, 2008, 3:53 am
>
>> I've got to admit, the monster has quite some attraction to me. The
>> aircooled twin, that characteristic sound, the desmo valve train.
>
> The bigger Monsters are water-cooled now. It's a shame because all the
> plumbing detracts from the essential simplicity that made the original
> Monsters look so attractive.
If I ever were to fall for one, I couldn't care less about the engine
size. There seems to be nothing wrong at all with the performance of the
696.
cu
.\arc
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>> No. The braking moment on the front wheel counters the force from weight
>> transfer, thereby holding the bike up. Research anti dive suspension.
>> You can have them on cars, too.
>>
>> It's plain physics.
>
> Go ahead, enlighten me.