Re: Great short distancer runners but Mother Nature left out the brains! - Page 5

 

Turby wrote:


That's what's good about Wikipedia, not bad.  You can go there and fix it.
Just use a bit more convincing argument than "I say so" during discussion
phase. ;-)

[...]
--
Andrzej Rosa

 



No, doofus, when you're steering strictly by shifting your weight,
I.E. riding without hands, you are *not* using countersteering. You
are causing the bike to turn by simply shifting your weight to one
side which causes the bike to lean in the opposite direction and
*that* makes the bike turn.

But (pay attention here) it turns in the direction *away* from the
direction the rider is leaning, because the contact point between the
rider and the bike (his behind) is acting as a pivot point, allowing
equal masses of both rider and bike to move in opposite directions.

Now go find a picture of a bike being ridden rapidly around a corner
*with hands* and note that the rider is leaning to the *inside* of the
turn. It's that way because when you're countersteering you first turn
the bars slightly to the *outside* of the direction you want to turn
and that causes the bike and rider to both fall gently over towards
the *inside* of the upcoming turn And they move as a *unit*; both bike
and rider leaning in the same direction.

Both the "riding without hands" method and countersteering will cause
the bike to lean over and turn, but they do it in differing ways: when
you're simply shifting your weight to steer, the bars never turn
towards the outside of the turn at all, and (pay attention) the name
for turning the bars towards the outside of a turn is
*countersteering*, I.E. steering *counter* to the direction you
actually want to go.

Since you don't (and can't) do this while steering strictly by weight
shifting, weight shifting doesn't (and can't) amount to
"countersteering"


No, he'll just go on being right and -from the evidence so far- you'll
just go right on being wrong. 

 

Twibil wrote:


Wash your mouth, son!  


Sure.  Now go out, son, take your pushbike, lean it in "the opposite
direction" and observe where the front wheel is pointing.  In "the opposite
direction", perhaps?  That is called countersteering phenomenon.
 

True (approximately).
 

False (precisely).  Go out and try it with your pushbike.  Or read the
publication I already quoted.  Or just think about it for a moment.  You
are a smart kid, you'll figure it out.  (Sorry for playing this patronizing
game, but going through all that again would be seriously boring
otherwise.)


You can and you do.  That's definitely not obvious, but I figured it out
anyway.  You can too.
 

Whatever.  I mean, there is a publication which supports my stance, so why
should I try to prove anything?  You guys do it.

--
Andrzej Rosa

 

Scout wrote:


The roads are bad, the traffic is hard, people drive aggressively and you
actually need to be in control of your vehicle to ride there.  Beside that,
nothing in particular.


They are the same, but I don't have cramps in my tight muscles from gripping
the tank very hard just to stay on top of my machine even in Poland.  I had
those in Romania during one long drive down the mountain road.  

Just to be fair, there were good enough roads there too, and I had a hell of
a time.  It simply must be something much different than America.  I never
was in America, but I spent some time in Germany, and both Germans and
Americans admitted that Germans drive more aggressively.  Now, Germans
often told me how nervous driving in Poland is to them, and Romania is even
worse.  Or better, depending how you see it.  I definitely had fun there
and we plan to go there again next year, this time for a bit longer.


I can get bored to death much cheaper here.  


Most kids I know aren't able to turn suddenly.  Definitely they can't take
avoidance maneuvers.  Freezing and crashing doesn't count as avoidance
action, even if it works.
 

That's why most riders suck.  (I suck too.  I'm not trying to look good
here.)


Funny thing is, that we tend to consider Americans to not be particularly
smart.  To put it mildly.

--
Andrzej Rosa

 

Vito wrote:


Countersteering can be understood both as a rider technique and a phenomenon
of the bike steering.  Just to avoid confusion, which one do you mean here?
Because while rider technique of countersteering isn't absolutely necessary
to steer the bike, your bike still needs to be made to countersteer to
initiate the turn.  In this other meaning countersteering is unavoidable.  

I just don't know if it makes sense to argue any further here.  

--
Andrzej Rosa