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Posted by Mark N on June 26, 2008, 10:23 am
Julian Bond wrote:
> This one is fascinating to watch. Try this idea on for size.
>
> A production motorcycle is one that is homologated for WSB, Superstock
> 1000 or WSS600. The limits are rising to 3000 per year. If it's not
> homologated for this, it must be a prototype and therefore eligible for
> use in a GP formula. In other words, what used to be called a
> homologation special, a short run special version of a road bike, *may*
> get round the FIM-FGSport agreement.
Where does that come from, is someone saying that?
> Of course the problem is that no manufacturer has ever produced a short
> run 600 special. But imagine that Honda produce a run of 100-500
> CBR600-RRSP with sand cast cases, barrels and heads. They could
> effectively create a one make replacement for 250GP. The bike would be
> like a Ten Kate WSS600 bike with any level of tune desired by the rules
> and at pretty much any price point from a Ten Kate WSS600 upwards. And
> you could imagine them selling engines to somebody like Moriwaki but
> being Honda they'd probably be leased and you wouldn't be able to get
> one without the right connections. And all the indications are that
> Honda want a one make Honda series.
>
> And it's hard to imagine Suzuki or Kawasaki doing the same short run of
> a competitive bike and a bit of a stretch to imagine Yamaha doing it.
> Ducati know how to do this, with their long history of homologation
> specials, but they don't have a 4 and aren't likely to any time soon.
The word out of Donington was that Honda would be contracted to build a
600cc spec race motor for the new class. That wouldn't be a spec bike,
because there chassis wouldn't be manufactured by Honda. Of course that
doesn't stop Honda from making a chassis. But it probably does stop
Yamaha, Suzuki and Kawasaki from making chassis - would they make
something intended to be run with a Honda motor? No.
And also that the route around the production problem would be to make
the class a non-world championship - apparently the rights to production
racing only apply to world championships, which strikes me as semantics,
but an interesting out.
> Now Dorna want to try and keep the price down, because one of the big
> stumbling blocks at the moment is Aprilia lease costs. So they're
> talking about dumb 1999 ECUs and carburettors! Along with steel valve
> springs, cam limits, crank/conrod/piston limits. The way they're talking
> it sounds like they want something sub-WSS600. Carbs, ferchrissake!
> Imagine a 120hp AMA FX [1] formula produced from bikes that never had a
> headlight in the first place.
Oh, jeez, NASCAR is now polluting racing at the world level!
> But now look at KTM. They've got experience of supplying a whole series
> with bikes and they've got a 990-V4 back in the workshop. It would be a
> big step but I think they know how to build a prototype 500-twin in
> enough numbers and at a profit to produce a KTM one make series. And
> they're just crazy enough to take on Honda politically. KTM are on a
> roll at the moment and have big ambition. It's just about feasible that
> Aprilia could join them and produce a short run 500-twin based on the
> work they've done with their coming V4 or their SV450/550.
And what controls cost there? Anything truly prototype without
restrictions is an economic loser.
> One further thought. If Aprilia is snubbed by all this, would Piaggio
> throw their hands up and just leave 125? Or are 125GP Aprilias/Gileras
> and Derbis just too important as a marketing tool for their road bikes
> and scooters? Because KTM could turn 125GP into a one make series as well.
Isn't Aprilia considering a reentry into MotoGP? And they surely
understand why Dorna wants to move beyond two strokes, it's not like
this isn't part of a much larger movement.
> So as well as FGSport-FIM vs Dorna-IRTA is this shaping up into a Honda
> vs KTM-Aprilia battle? With the other Japanese factories and Ducati
> standing on the sidelines because they can take it or leave it.
The problem there is the production thing, of course. And if they can
get around that by just declaring that the class is not a world
championship, that's great. As you know, I don't think the support
classes should be world championships anyway, given that their purpose
is in part rider development for MotoGP. Not a fan of the spec motor
thing, though.
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